Amerika

Recently I was fortunate to participate in a great dialogue with Kevin Alfred Strom, who many of you know as a writer about White Nationalist and other Ethnat topics over the past four decades. We talked about the Wop Question:

Brett:

No, [wops are not White — they] were originally White but became miscegenated.

Kevin:

Ridiculous to claim that one of the most culturally contributive White nations, Italy (which is in the _top five_ nations, objectively rated in the book Human Accomplishment, well above the nation of my own ancestry), is “not White.”

Brett:

Once upon a time, Italy was White.

Then came trace miscegenation.

Now Italy is more Arab than White.

Kevin:

Absurd. Though I have no Italian ancestry (100% Norwegian here), I used to be the engineer for an Italian cultural program in the Washington and Baltimore area. Through my work, I have met and known many hundreds of Italians, and taken as a whole they were just as White, just as accomplished, just as noble-faced and open-hearted, and definitely more pro-White and racially-aware as my family line back in Minnesota. Joan Tosti, Dr. William Pierce’s secretary, was Italian, as was Nick Camerota, one of his first feature writers.

Brett:

I live in a port city and have met Italians outside of the upper classes of northern Italy, who tend to have more German in them.

Too much inclusion of trace admixture is White genocide.

Kevin:

DNA analysis in the last few decades has proved that today’s Sardinians are very, very close to the original inhabitants of Europe before Aegean Farmers arrived (which was also well before the Indo-Europeans arrived). In fact, native Sardinians are the least admixed people in Europe. I don’t at all agree with you that Italians as a whole are excessively admixed with extra-European genes or bad genes — though I do, of course, believe that all White nationalities could do with a healthy dose of eugenics, not only to address undesirable admixture but to counteract centuries of dysgenic breeding.

I suspect that the Italians I met were, like most Italian immigrants to the US, mostly from southern Italy. Mrs. Tosti’s husband’s family came from Siena; I don’t know where her ancestors hailed from. The head of the cultural group, Pino Cicala, was from Messina.

Brett:

The genetic data is pretty clear on Italians.

Even more, we just need to look at them. Big noses, semicircular eyebrows, dark features… they even look Semitic.

Eugenics needs a revisitation of course, since there is a lot of cleaning up to do in any group, and it needs to be permanent since nature is always producing mutation load through gene drift.

Sardinians and people from Cornwall, perhaps, but those were groups from long ago who were splintered from the original Yamnaya or other proto-Nordic groups, and they may have had other stuff in there. Regardless, regular Italians are quite different from Sardinians, Basques, and Cornish.

Kevin:

I still disagree with your take. My experience of interacting with Italian-descended people and families is one of not only overwhelming Whiteness and kinship, but in many cases true excellence. I could never condone consigning literally millions of good White people, kin of the hundreds I met, to “outsider” status. How cruel and absurd that would be. Yes, Italy needs some eugenics, but so does every White country. And I also feel reasonably certain that any racial movement that tells people that perfectly-White granddad or uncle Fred “isn’t really White” is not going to fly. By the way, I held these views for 39 years before marrying a quarter-Italian girl in 2019 and having three children with her — so far — so that isn’t the source of my convictions. I feel the same way about those who want to exclude eastern Europeans.

Brett:

39 years is quite impressive. I started writing tentatively on these topics in the late 1980s when I was running a BBS in Houston. It became clear to me that diversity, through no fault of any group, was destroying my hometown.

I have discussed this topic with Dr Pierce, Laurence Auster, Mr Roper, and others, and it always comes down this:

‘And I also feel reasonably certain that any racial movement that tells people that perfectly-White granddad or uncle Fred “isn’t really White” is not going to fly.’

That is politics, or the notion that we need to rope together as many white warm bodies in order to gain political power.

I take an opposite approach: whoever is most honest and most realistic makes the most useful tools for understanding our world, and therefore wins in the free markets of ideas.

In the same way that I oppose racial diversity, therefore, I oppose ethnic diversity, including white ethnic diversity: it has the same problem as racial diversity.

Congratulations on your 2019 marriage, by the way. I’m still getting used to it being 2025.

However, I think we need to look at history:

* After Rome fell, miscegenation was common in Italy, and the society entered a dark age which it only came out of through Western European investment and tourist dollars.

* Eastern, Southern/Irish, and Mediterranean Europe have not produced a single functional government since Franco.

* Italy lost a war… to Ethiopia.

* Spaniards have high Moorish admixture, Irish have high Semitic admixture, and Italians have high Arab and other admixture; Eastern Europe has Asiatic admixture. How much do we want? Jews are perhaps 2-5% non-White DNA at this point; Italians, Irish, and Slavs are similar percentages. If you mix these together, you end up with non-Whites pretending to White, like in South America.

* For some reason, England, the Netherlands, Scandinavia, Scotland, and Germany rose above the post-miscegenation Italians and Southern, Eastern, and Med Europe generally.

* I have lived around Russians, Poles, Vietnamese, Irish, “white” South Americans, Mexicans, Salvadorians, Venezuelans, Chileans, Costa Ricans, and Panamanians. None of these groups are on par with the Anglo-Saxon world in terms of competence or moral alertness.

* Mixing together trace miscegenated “huwhites” will simply produce a lower-performing “huwhite” group like we see in Southern, Irish, Eastern, and Mediterranean Europe today.

White Nationalists back in the 1990s argued for what I call #WIMP — White International Melting Pot — but that made no sense to those of us from actually ethnically-and-racially diverse areas, where we could see how different European-descended groups are.

There’s a reason New York had Italian and Irish ghettos. These people are not just trace miscegenated, but products of failed empires, which is probably thousands of times the impact that Communism had on East Germans, many of whom are morally and intellectually wrecked.

Undoubtedly #WIMP is better than #SIMP (Southern International Melting Pot, like the BRICS or Global South merged into the West) but not good enough.

White Nationalism failed and it took Trump to frame this as an anti-DEI/immigration issue for it to have wings.

White people do not want to become generic whites. It is a non-seller, in part because all of us can look at the condition of Eastern, Southern, Irish, and Mediterranean Europe and say “no thank you!”

I have always said that maybe some Italians are White, but the last time I was there, these were very few… and the ones who literally looked like Mexicans or Vietnamese were many.

My goal is to be honest and realistic about all things. These are two separate things, the latter controlling the former.

To be realistic is to encounter impolitic and impolite views of the world.

For example, I don’t consider Eastern Europeans white because of the Asiatic admixture, similar to what Turks, Saami, and Jews have going on.

I don’t consider Italians to be white any more than I consider Jews white. Same admixture, same ingredients, in those cases.

Every Irish person I have known has been missing some fundamental building blocks in perception of the world. I think something went very wrong there, like in California, probably starting with the Semitic roots of the Irish.

I can be honest and talk about these things, or not.

The last functional America was #WASPAmerica, and there’s a reason for that: ethnic Western European people are Western Civilization, and when they mix you get modern Italy, which is totally dysfunctional, corrupt, and filthy.

It literally smells like Mexico and people drive the same way. Rome was a great empire, but Italy is land of the lawnmower like Mexico.

Kevin:

I am very glad I don’t see the world and the race that way.

For some background, Mr Strom published a biography covering his background and approach:

Born in 1956 in Anchorage, Alaska, the son of third-generation Norwegian-American parents, Kevin Alfred Strom moved to northern Virginia as a child. He attended George Mason University in Fairfax, Virginia but did not take a degree, describing his education as “mainly the product of my own reading and interaction with several of the finest friends, teachers, and mentors a man could ever want this side of ancient Athens.”

His interest in politics and ideas began when he was only 12 years old. He worked with William L. Pierce, Richard Cotten, and Revilo Oliver beginning in the early 1980s, producing hundreds of radio, audio and video programs, thousands of essays, and numerous articles, books, periodicals and anthologies.

A radio amateur since 1972 and a broadcast engineer since 1976, his first foray into electronic publishing was as the operator of a C64-based dial up Bulletin Board System in the Washington, DC area in the mid-1980s. In 1991, he began producing radio programs heard on more than two dozen AM, FM, and shortwave broadcast stations. In 1994, he began Internet distribution of those programs as well as written material, and in 1995 he began what eventually became the Revilo Pendleton Oliver Web site.

He also maintains a links list of far-Right writers, organizations, and resources.

Tags: italian-americans, italians, kevin alfred strom, national alliance, romans, trace miscegenation, white nationalism, wop question